Dylan also writes in his journal that. The second of the Columbine killers, Dylan Klebold was a "born genius" who, despite a sensitive disposition, experienced explosions of rage (most often brought on by failure or humiliation,) suicidal tendencies, a disdain for the "zombie"-like human race, and a suggestibility upon which the psychopathic . As she says, The rest of the world could explain away what he had done: either he was born evil a bad seed or hed been raised without moral guidance. In my opinion, what went on in their home led to Columbine.. ", Eric: "Morris, Nate, if you guys live, I want you guys to have whatever you want from my room and the computer room.". Byron Klebold - The Everlasting Contrast Sue is from a prominent Jewish community . It would drive me insane to have my kids behave like that, but some people are utterly oblivious to the cacaphony and strife being caused by their children. And although there was never anything we could do to put him away, so to speak, before he hurt someone, my mother would *never* claim in an aftermath that she had no idea of his mental state or his comings and goings or that she didn't know what made him that way. So they actually DO blame the kids for setting off their little angels on a murderous rampage. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris had openly admired Adolf Hitler. Goodbye. Under different circumstances it would've been a lot different. That's not contrition, it's a final fuck you to the world. If there is a hell, they are there, burning. However, it is my understanding from reviews that he contends the boys actually had a circle of friends and were, in fact, popular within that group. (talks about his mother being thoughtful, bringing him candy and Slim Jims) "I really am sorry about all this. It profiles Sue Klebold, Dylan Klebold's mother, and examines what lessons Americans should take away from the tragedy. Eric Harris was an American murderer from Wichita, Kansas. The Klebolds said their son was set off by the toxic culture of the school, where athletes were worshipped and bullying was tolerated. Born: 4-9-1981. The interview is set to air on "20/20" this Friday, coinciding with . Can you imagine having one of those monsters as your brother? At the same time, the father must have believed that his son's future was still bright. For a couple reasons. Sue and her husband were vehemently opposed, but Dylan still asked for a gun for Christmas his final year. Getty, AP, AP, AFP/Getty. I don't think it's fair to either demonize or absolve them, but from studies of psychopathy, even the best parenting can't make that be turned off. Most of you posters here are complete idiots and voiceofthenight is the biggest moron of them all. Sue provides details that help us address some of the other considerations as well. [quote]He has always been excessively cruel to animals (he even shot and killed his own dog because it barked), obsessed with weapons, "charmingly" manipulative of adults, a pathological liar, disdainful of other people and abusive to them and VERY quick to anger. Adding to the tragedy: Six months after Hochhalter's wounding, her mother, Carla, took her own life. These two need to be gutted and hung out for the vultures. Theyd never seen his rage, nor ever felt scared of him. "Doctors" can profit, too, financially, when their names are attached to certain "studies.". Sue acknowledges that before Columbine, she would have reacted to news of some horrific act by wondering what that persons parents must have been like to allow someone to turn out like that. Several phone callers to the Jewish News have . Who is "limiting" the discussion to the brain? What can I say, the mention of Dave Cullen's book piqued my curiosity. . so it seems that they had a pretty solid relationship from what has been released. I read a book about young doctors and they were discussing whether you can teach compassion. KIN HOLD RITES FOR KILLER SON - Orlando Sentinel I was in high school at the time. The oblivious parents in Target or sitting inside their houses listening to their kids having a meltdown and completely ignoring it. What happened to them? In my defense, R78, everyone knew I wrote the best hand. Dylan Klebold led life of religious contradictions - J. Pais was a student at Miami Beach High School who was reportedly obsessed with the school shooting at Columbine, the high school where 13 people were shot and killed 20 years ago. It was obvious that the attack had been in the works for a long time, and the plan carefully thought out. In April 1981, Harris was born in Wichita, Kansas. Eric David Harris - a Columbine site , What was the deadliest school shooting? . Am I supposed to be impressed by dates, VOTN? February 12, 2016 11:56am. Second, the reason no one at the school noticed is because no one is ever trained to notice. Sunday, April 25, 1999; Page A8. As a teen, Dylans aversion to embarrassment became more severe, his self-consciousness more pointed. ", Dylan: (sticks his face in the camera) "Goodbye. Parents are not automatically responsible for the behavior of their teenage children. They then killed themselves in the school library. ", "If they had even one shred of decency they would have taken full responsibility for creating and shaping and not monitoring these monsters.". What kind of parent lets their kid have a swastika prominently displayed in their room (as just one of many, many signs that their offspring had problems)? Another migrant here from the other Columbine thread who's reading Cullen's book--. I recently watched the documentary Raising Adam Lanza, and, though it wasnt as detailed, there were some interesting overlaps between Adam and Dylan. Don't believe me? Brown can . Based on what I've read so far, he's working off the assumption that Klebold was a depressive with self-destructive tendencies (he mentions suicide over and over in the journal kept for two years prior to the incident), and that Harris was a full-blown psychopath. Reb". That's why Dylan got one for Christmas 99, it was Tom's way of finding something to bond with with Dylan. The mother of Columbine killer Dylan Klebold says she thinks every day about the people her . Brookscolumn did not say when and where the interview took place. As I often do, Ill leave the author the last word on why understanding the process her son went through is important: Dylan was vulnerable in many ways unquestionably emotionally immature, depressed, possibly suffering from a more serious mood or personality disorder. I couldn't put the book down, and even though I thought I knew the ending of the story, or at least most of it, I have to admit, the last couple of chapters, specifically the one detailing the Basement Tapes, and the one about what had happened leading up to Harris and Klebold committing suicide were fucking frightening. Yaron Steinbuch. He was afraid Dylan might be involved. Eric Harris was quite the hottie, I don't understand why he had to go and kill himself. Both are from Columbus, Ohio and went to Ohio State University. How can you not hear your child scream? Focus on the mental. On a calendar entry dated the day of the attack, April 20, the time 11:10 is written across the top an approximate reference to when Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold pulled out their weapons . Every parent has flaws and every parent makes mistakes, but to me they mostly come across as a very normal family like there are millions all over the world. VOTN, I have Cullen's book but have not yet started it. The pair . . After the killing: How parents of attackers cope. Washingtonpost.com: Shooter Pair Mixed Fantasy, Reality Weren't they in a small group of rebellious kids? Talking about the home video they took of that day, Its absolutely stunning how normal Dylan seems (p. 235). Eric Harris' Parents & Brother, Wayne, Kathy & Kevin Harris: 5 Fast Tom Klebold said they hope to understand someday why the shooting happened. Hers was a love as dark and true, as embracing and self-abnegating, as Cordelia's. On April 20, 1999, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, seniors at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colo., placed . "This was murder," he said. On Dylan's part, I think that in January 1999, he was depressed and preparing to die - distancing himself from those he loved, so that it would be easier for him to carry out the attack. What I am saying is that the cause is something deeper and more primal than "society.". Unfortunately, we only have her word today as to what went on in the home. In them, its obvious to see how his anger and rage turned from being directed toward himself to directed toward others. This is true. Posted 3 years ago x93Thatx94 happened to x93themx94 because they were bad parents, we could tell ourselves. They crowned a queen, they crowned a king. Over time, they became increasingly close, hanging out by often going out bowling, carpooling and playing the video game Doom over a private server connected to their personal computers. Columbine High School Shooting: Victims & Killers - HISTORY Plus the drug industry makes a profit. Haven't most of you been able to conceal your homosexuality from your family for a number of years? I must say, that rings true to me Id personally say it was because I was so self-sufficient and trustworthy as a child that my parents had no idea when I was going through (relative) difficulty in adolescence. Children learn psychopathy from their parents (e.g., the Bushes). R77, there are people who don't have feelings. A place to discuss the massacre that took place at Columbine High School in Littleton, CO on April 20th, 1999. From what we cam tell, the Harris family took a laissez-faire attitude towards Eric. The real tragedy of Columbine isn't the deaths, it's the failure to work to change our culture (from bullying to gun control) in the aftermath. ". "However, there is credible, tangible, measurable, and repeatable evidence that there are some people, for whatever reason, have their brains wired differently.". Dylan wrote an essay about a school shooting that disturbed his teacher enough that it was referred to the school counselor. Without one factor (their brains) or the other (the guns), this wouldn't have happened the way it did, but I don't see the point of dismissing/elevating one over the other. Ericx92s parents, too, did what parents do. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris killed 13 people on April 20, 1999, before taking their own lives. ", Eric "If only we would have searched their room. Find it interesting Tom would say he was Dylan's best friend. I don't think I can categorize Dylan's relationship with his parents as bad or good, because Dylan was incredibly disturbed teen and clearly had a skewed perception of reality. Or, as Eric himself said, quoting Shakespeare, in the farewell video he left for his parents: x93Good wombs have borne bad sons.x94. I say this as a person who worked as an assistant to special needs kids for years. Similiarly if a child is screaming at playmates and/or siblings and will not stop, you have to move in and take control of the situation. Hi Alison, People that want to pretend that the parents were just innocent distant bystanders who had no responsibility for anything that happened are repulsive. i think he was also quoted saying that he had lost his best friend. All the bullying stuff is bullshit. And now she won't show it. She didn't do anything that would be perceived as spying. To be clear, I'm sure the Klebold's obviously loved their children, but reading Dylan's writings, there was more going on in that home that Sue would say today. That's the first thing. Harris was born in Wichita, Kansas, on April 9, 1981. There are a myriad of factors to consider. ", Dylan: (interrupts) "We did what we had to do. While Id argue that violent media doesnt cause people to act violently if theyre not otherwise inclined, it seems Dylan was vulnerable to the violent games and movies he consumed outside the home. His grades fell to average. It may have hurt him. WOuldn't one of the friends have felt him a little bit off, at the least? I just wanted to apologize to you guys for any crap this might instigate as far as (inaudible) or something. Eric and Dylan worked extremely hard to conceal their machinations. I wish the Harris and Klebold parents were rotting in prison right now as a lesson to parents that wash their hands of it and say "not my problem. multiple newspapers and media outlets in the days after reported dylan and his father having the kind of relationship where, when dylan would come home from school, they would share a snack and read the sports section of the newspaper together. When you think about it, in his journals he didn't have too much positive to say across the board. Sue Klebold is the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the two shooters at Columbine High School in 1999 who killed 15 people before ending their own lives, a tragedy that saddened and galvanized the nation. It's getting late; Eric looks at his watch and says it's 1:28 AM on March 15. Columbine: Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold''s Parents (2023) Wayne worked as a transport pilot for the United States Air Force, while . Dylan Klebold was 17 when he and Harris,18, carried out their long-planned attack on the high school about 13 miles south of downtown Denver. Sue Klebold is the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the two shooters who committed the Columbine High School massacre, murdering 12 students and a teacher. Both were from Columbus, Ohio and went to Ohio State University. She is the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the perpetrators of the Columbine High School massacre that occurred on April 20, 1999. Even after he broke into a car and stole stuff, there was no monitoring of his time spent making pipe bombs or firing guns or playing video games that glorified killing. End of story. His point is that "society" didn't have too much of anything to do with how Harris turned out--he was born that way. He and his partner Dylan Klebold were responsible for the Columbine High School massacre (1999). We didnt realize it until after the end, Tom Klebold said. We relate. i dont particularly envision tom to be the type of parent to humiliate or pressure his sons. On April 20, 1999, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold stormed into Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado and murdered 13 people before killing themselves. Murder Most Foolish | Psychology Today The half-Jewish Dylan Klebold is more of a cipher. I could have built an atomic bomb in my bedroom and they wouldn't have known or cared. Mother of Columbine shooter reflects on that day, 19 years later Tom and I failed to recognize these conditions and to curtail the influences violent entertainment, his friendship with Eric that exacerbated them. His father Wayne was a U.S. Air Force transport pilot . Harris's father erroneously stated that his son was "a member of what they call the Trenchcoat Mafia" in a 9-1-1 call he made on April 20, 1999. [quote]But even if you work with them to avoid their *own* pain, that's a start. The perpetrator often has faced peer or social rejection, endured bullying, has anger about the bullying, and lacks the social or coping skills to deal with these issues. His parents knew this, though not the extent of it. . Virginia Tech. It is actually a lot of conformist bunk to serve the status quo. Harris was a sociopath. Firstly, like everyone else he didn't pick up on his mental health nor was Dylan apparently showing it to his 'best friend.'. They do not have a moral center that can be reached. He didn't even say hi to Tom or ask how he was. I can't believe Oprah canceled her Columbine show today. By his junior and senior years, Dylans parents knew something was wrong. Apparently his meds caused an issue with a military enlistment, but wouldn't a caring parent sit down with their kid and figure out a Plan B? Dylan Klebold's father, is Lutheran, and said her son . He's wearing a plaid shirt, either dark blue or black with white; the shirt's untucked. He did it in contradiction to the way he was raised.. Tom is a geophysicist, Sue works with handicapped people. I couldn't do that to my family and I admit that I would never have the guts. When I was in high school, my mother knew everyone I went, who I associated with, what I read, what I had my room, etc. FULL DOCO - PT 2 OF 3, 2. "He said, 'One of the boys my son shot said Dylan was a nice kid,' " Berg says. This thread is going to hell in jig time if it turns into the all-too-familiar "they were running up and down the aisles and that caused Columbine!!!" He became more paranoid, forcing them all to flee a McDonalds because he believed a group of teens on the other side of the store were laughing at him. I just don't get it. IIRC, they both had psychiatric attention. Shocking crime scene photos explode the myths and reveal shocking details! i cannot remember nor can i find the source for this but im half certain its in his interview in the 11k. I'm with VoTN on this one. Sue Klebold. To me its really hard to determine the quality of a relationship based on how teenagers feel about it. . Okay, well, first of all, gifted programs don't monitor shit. Klebold, S. (2016). Dylan adds that they can have his things as well. Sue Klebold - Biography, Facts, Family Life I'm not saying that there's no guilt, no responsibility, because no matter how our brains are wired, we're all creatures of free will and able to make moral choices, but to lay everything at the feet of society, or the parents, or the school, is way, way too simple. Answer (1 of 2): His mother has (admirably, if belatedly) committed herself to educating people on how to spot the signs of malignant tendencies in their children in an effort to help separate real danger signs from "normal" teen BS. From her comment on her official website, she felt it was disrespectful to focus on the killers when today should be all about the victims. In the vacuum of actual news, they just start over again. His parents didnt understand the full extent of it, but high school wasnt turning out to be a kind place for him. As Dylan entered adolescence, he became a bit more complicated. ", Eric: (shrugs) "My parents might have made some mistakes that they weren't really aware of. His parents were Wayne and Katherine. You shouldn't attack people for the actions of their offspring. Dylan Klebold's mother: 'I felt I was a good mom' - New York Post He had been in a gifted child program, and you'd think they'd have some type of monitoring since kids who are that advanced frequently have problems. Very few people really care. Apologies in advance if this question has already been answered. I've linked an article from Nature magazine about it. Eric was born in Wichita, Kansas. A Mothers Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy. These incidents happen because the majority of people choose to look the other way if a kid seems a little off. Eric Harris & Dylan Klebold | Programmed To Kill For an optimal experience visit our site on another browser. They may show cruelty to animals, or alternatively a high degree of affection or attachment to animals. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. But there isn't one thing. Dylan's mother, Sue Klebold, confirmed to radio host Terry Gross on "Fresh Air" Tuesday that she is Jewish, and her now ex-husband, Dylan Klebold's father, is Lutheran, and said her son . What have I raised? I think that even I have sustained some slight rewiring from that, though not anywhere *near* to the extent of my brother's. It just seems all a bit odd. And now she won't show it. I don't believe I've said anything about gun control, of which this country has far too little of. We are not violent.I would never do a shooting even though I work in an office with a bunch of former jocks and homecoming queens that haven't changed since they left school and are still as awful now as they were then. Susan insists, "I haven't done anything for which I need forgiveness." if anyone can correct or find the sources for me that would be greatly appreciated! (p. 277). They are rare. I honestly do believe (and so does mom) that his brain has been rewired primarily by a head injury he sustained when he was just toddling. His father was an Air Force pilot, and moved him and his . Bedwetting, firesetting and cruelty to animals. Yet later, he sees them more as zombiestrickier though andmore manipulative. I certainly understand how they feel. But Sue and her husband didnt know what the signs they were seeing meant. It was weird. Asking how instead of why allows us to frame the descent into self-destructive behavior as the process that it is. His parents were Wayne Harris and his wife Katherine Ann Poole. Though posthumous diagnosis isnt possible, that Dylan was seriously depressed is not up for debate (p. 160), and his behaviors might have also fit the criteria for other diagnoses such as avoidant personality disorder, schizotypal personality disorder, and/or borderline personality disorder. When Your Child Kills: The Parents of Criminals - The Daily Beast Sue Klebold Recalls What Her Son Dylan Was Like at Home: Part 2. Just as the son's evil made people go back and re-evaluate his dad, discovering examples like the time Poppy sabotaged his opponent's sail boat the night before the race; one wonders if one should investigate more closely the dealings of the Harrises. They are particularly good at it. Sorry if I can't be interested in something without arousing your ire. [quote]Did Harris or Klebold have any siblings? I encourage you to study the footage and reach out to others in the comments. It is absolutely the parents vault. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were charged with theft, criminal mischief, and criminal trespassing for breaking into a van and . A Mother's Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy - Goodreads If that;s the case, why did he have so many friends? Its hard to tell. On August 30, 2006 Columbine obsessed 18 year old Alvaro Castillo would murder his father with a sawed off Mossberg 500 shotgun at their home and then drive to a local high school and open fire. He was enrolled in a program for juvenile offenders run by the county court, he was taken to a psychiatrist and given both therapy and medication. ", Dylan: (talks about how his parents taught him to be independent and self-reliant) "I appreciate that.". I guess it's my generation. A Further Examination: Sue Klebold's case study of her son, Dylan I found this thred on accident and had to comment. The couple took issue with people who say they forgive them for what happened. When it came to intervention, these people had no idea what they should have been doing. I had to fight for their basic rights because allegedly educated teachers thought things like "retards are dangerous" and "retards should be kept away from the good kids". "I just don't know how something that is so basic as how the brain works is something that can be treated with therapy.". Sorry. R16 = Female with daddy issues who doesn't take kindly to unkind remarks toward her fellow twats. His negative traits werent out of the ordinary either, really: he was very sensitive to embarrassment, which sometimes led to anger; and he was perhaps a little too independent, where he wouldnt ask for help even if he needed it like when he had to take a break from baseball after pains he never mentioned became so bad they caused his arm real damage. Attention was paid. What happened isn't their fault. She behaves as if it is normal, as if she doesn't even hear it. Not to cure it, to manage it. Is that correct? If only we would have asked the right questions." Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. The parents cars were in the driveway. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris killed 13 people on April 20, 1999, before taking their own lives. How they could live with themselves is beyond me. Brooks said the Klebolds agreed to the interview after an exchange of e-mails initiated by Tom Klebold, who was angered by Brooks April 24 column. Klebold and Dylan's father, Tom, endured not only . The problem, Cullen concludes, was that there is almost nothing that can be done to help psychopaths. OP is an idiot, laying the whole thing at the parents' door. Maybe I'm just feeling too knowledgeable having been re-reading Steve Pinker's "How The Mind Works" recently. IE 11 is not supported. So no, nothing in the gifted program could have helped this kid. But a new book, x93Columbine,x94 by Dave Cullen, reviews every bit of evidence about the shooting short of the parentsx92 firsthand accounts x97 25,000 pages of documents, including videotapes and journals of the killers x97 all of which point to the same chilling conclusion as the Carneal depositions: it is entirely possible for x93goodx94 parents to raise a murderer. "some manipulate, like my parents.". WTF?!? She and the father lectured him, took away . Brian Rohrbough, father of victim Daniel Rohrbough, said he was outraged that the Klebolds likened the day of the shootings to a natural disaster in the interview with Brooks.

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